Response to interpellation 2023/24:554 on social dumping

Statsrådet Erik Slottner (KD)

Mr. Speaker! Eva Lindh has asked me what measures I intend to take to counteract or stop social dumping.

Active participation in settlement in another municipality is a multifaceted issue that, among other things, concerns the availability of housing and the opportunities to secure employment. It is also a question of how the municipalities interpret and apply the Settlement Act (2016:38) and the Social Services Act (2001:453) in different ways.

The Government is mindful that there is a well-functioning cooperation between the municipalities and continues to follow the issue. According to the regulatory letters for 2024, the county administrative boards shall therefore report on whether the municipalities actively contribute to their municipal residents settling in another municipality. The reporting shall be carried out within the framework of the county administrative boards' existing activities, such as work concerning sustainable social planning and housing, integration, and the promotion of cooperation between the municipalities.

A large proportion of those who have changed place of residence through active participation have been newcomers. The Government has decided that a special investigator shall propose a new system for the settlement of newcomers. The purpose is to increase the municipalities' influence over the reception of newcomers and create good conditions for an equal, uniform, and flexible reception. The Government also wants to introduce a system with establishment housing, which means that the municipalities arrange a time-limited housing solution for a maximum of three years for newcomers who have been assigned to the municipality.

I also want to mention the ongoing work in the parliamentary committee A Purposeful Municipal Economic Equalization (dir. 2022:36). This is to be reported in July 2024. The committee is looking, among other things, at the system for cost equalization. They have been tasked with analyzing whether it compensates to a sufficient extent for socioeconomic factors and shall, if necessary, propose changes. The purpose of the municipal economic equalization system is to equalize for differences in tax capacity and uncontrollable factors such as age structure and socioeconomic factors, for example education and income levels as well as length of residence in Sweden.

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Eva Lindh (S)

Mr. Speaker! I thank the Minister for Civil Affairs very much for the answer to the interpellation. It is not the first time we have debated exactly this. Last time, I believe we did so at the end of August last year, about half a year ago.

Why are we doing this again? Why should the Minister for Civil Affairs have to stand here and answer the question and debate? Yes, this is of course an incredibly important issue for us who are standing here and debating, but above all for the people who are affected and for the municipal politicians who feel for and protect them but see great difficulties in handling the issue.

Just this week, I have spoken with three municipal politicians who testify to how it looks. Of course, it looks different in different ways. Some have been relocated, and the municipality that actively participated in moving the person has paid the first two months' rents. Others have not done so. But what one sees as a line in this is that the people who have felt forced to move have indeed done so. Some municipalities have said that it is a choice between ceasing to receive support and moving. It is therefore a tough challenge for very many people, and what is happening is undignified.

One of the reasons for this situation is that many municipalities previously have not built different types of housing that it is possible for people to move into. Not everyone can live in a villa. Some have no other option than to live in a rental apartment, but some municipalities have not built such. Now we have a situation where almost nothing is being built at all. We have a housing crisis here in Sweden. It has decreased by somewhere between 60 and 70 percent during this year - I don't remember exactly. This will worsen the conditions for this group and, of course, for all people in all of Sweden who are seeking new housing. It will worsen the situation.

In any case, we have a situation where what we call social dumping of people exists. I believe it is 105 people - I do not remember the exact figure, but it is over 100 - who have alerted that they have been subjected to social dumping or what the Minister for Civil Affairs calls active participation. It has occurred on several occasions, and there are people behind this.

When we and the Social Democratic-led government heard about this, we appointed an inquiry to see the extent of it and what measures could be taken. But it did not take very long before the new SD-led government scrapped the inquiry on social dumping. We have managed to get some answers, as the inquiry managed to look into this a little bit. But the answers that we really need, we do not get now. This concerns both how it looks in general and what measures we need to take. Therefore, I pose the question today: What does the Minister for Civil Affairs intend to do?

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Peter Hedberg (S)

Mr. Speaker! I may be hoping for too much now, but I did hear a very hopeful tone in the previous debate. Now in this final debate on Friday, I have great expectations for the result. We shall see how it ends.

I thank the Minister for the answer and, of course, I thank Eva Lindh for the interpellation. Just as Eva Lindh says, we have debated this on several occasions in slightly different configurations. In the debate that I participated in last year, we spent some time trying to agree on whether social dumping is actually a problem. We reached a consensus on that, and I think the Minister for Civil Affairs expresses that now as well.

However, I do not think that any active measures have been taken after the investigation into social dumping was laid down at the turn of the year 2022/23. I hear from the Minister's answer that the government still places quite a lot of hope in the tax equalization investigation and specifically the issue of compensation for socio-economic factors. I absolutely think it is commendable to review that part, but I would like to ask what it actually has to do with social dumping. This was something we were into in an earlier debate as well. I wonder: Does this mean that the Minister envisions some kind of silent acceptance of the phenomenon of social dumping and that municipalities that are compensated within the framework of the tax equalization system are simply to accept it? I would like the Minister to clarify what he and the government hope to achieve through this additional directive to the tax equalization investigation specifically in relation to social dumping.

The question of how common this is has been raised quite a bit in the debate. It is difficult to answer that question. There are many municipalities that have witnessed the problems in waves. My home municipality, Kramfors, started a proper advocacy effort about five years ago to draw attention to the issue. At that time, we also noticed that an important part of the problem is that this occurs over different periods of time and to different extents, as well as involving different groups of people. A municipality can, for example, have 80 clear cases of social dumping one year, while in year two it sees no cases at all, but then in year three it can clearly see that the problem is on its way back. Since the phenomenon seems to vary over time but also geographically across all of Sweden, I think it is a pity that the investigation which was supposed to look at possible measures against social dumping was discontinued.

I note in the Minister's response that it is referred to that the county administrative boards have been tasked to map out whether the municipalities are actively contributing to their residents settling in other municipalities. It is very good to receive additional data, but I think that we already have sufficient data in many respects. That was precisely why the Social Democratic-led government, just as Eva Lindh said, commissioned the investigation from the very beginning. I feel that we may have stepped back a few steps. Based on the assignment to the county administrative boards that the Minister refers to and the picture he can see, I nevertheless want to ask if the Minister and the government are prepared to proceed with some political measures to counter social dumping. I accept that more knowledge base may be needed. I accept that more information may be needed and that the government needs to take it in. But once that has been obtained, are you then prepared to proceed with active political proposals? That is my question.

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Statsrådet Erik Slottner (KD)

Mr. Speaker! This is my third interpellation debate today. I had hoped that I would avoid having to provide the following factual clarification during this debate, but unfortunately, I must do so, as the term "SD-led government" appeared in one of the statements.

I want to clarify for those following the debate that this government is not ruled by SD. This is a government consisting of three parties: the Moderates, the Christian Democrats, and the Liberals. The Prime Minister belongs to the Moderates and is named Ulf Kristersson. The government has a parliamentary cooperation with the Sweden Democrats in the Riksdag. The Sweden Democrats therefore do not sit in the government and thus do not rule the government, but cooperate with the government parliamentarily in order to be able to guarantee and secure parliamentary support. We live in a democracy. For the government to pass its policies, a majority in the Riksdag is required. That is how the Tidö cooperation looks, but the government is therefore not ruled by the Sweden Democrats. The government consists of the Moderates, the Christian Democrats, and the Liberals.

In the interpellation, reference is made to what reports have concluded, but not to any specific reports. I therefore assume that what the interpellator refers to are the reports from Statskontoret and the Länsstyrelsen Östergötland, which I believe arrived in 2020 and 2021 and which we base ourselves on. It appears there that social dumping or active participation in settlement in another municipality is a problem in its own right in the country.

It should however be said that a great deal has happened in Sweden since then. Not least, migration has decreased significantly, and the number of newcomers covered by the Settlement Act is considerably smaller now than it was during the years the reports refer to. The vast majority of those affected by this phenomenon are precisely newcomers, and the large number of newcomers also largely explains the extensive debate that has been ongoing. This should therefore be a smaller problem today than when these reports were produced.

With this in mind, we have now, in the regulatory letter to the county administrative boards, tasked not only the County Administrative Board of Östergötland but all 21 county administrative boards to look at the occurrence in their respective counties. We know that the smallest county administrative board has 5 municipalities in its county and the largest 49 municipalities, so the scope will of course be different.

I think it is interesting to see what the extent looks like today, and what I also think is good about giving the county administrative boards this assignment is that they already today have developed and well-established contacts with the municipalities. Not least in those cases where active participation in relocation occurs within the county administrative board's geographical boundaries, one can hope that an exchange occurs between the municipalities within the framework of the dialogue with the county administrative board, which could contribute to resolving the problem. We know, for instance, that municipalities through direct dialogue have been able to completely escape this phenomenon. I think it is quite interesting to point out what power this inter-municipal cooperation has, or at least can have.

I also received a question about the tax equalization investigation and how we hope the supplementary directive could contribute. The supplementary directive itself has nothing to do with this, as it concerns the growth and high-tax issues. However, we believe that this phenomenon should affect at least the socioeconomic parameters. The question is whether this compensates for it to a sufficiently high degree. We will have to see if the committee reaches any conclusions regarding that.

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Eva Lindh (S)

Mr. Speaker! I might start where the Minister for Civil Affairs finished, in the investigation on the equalization system. We know now that the equalization system does not equalize when it comes to social dumping. This means that the municipality that receives is not compensated to such a large extent for the costs when this occurs. If one were to compensate, it would therefore mean very large changes in the equalization system - just as part of one answer.

Like, as my party colleague wants to say, we are not just looking for how we can compensate. We are looking for how we can stop social dumping.

If one were to compensate, it would naturally facilitate things for the municipalities and thus also for the people involved, because there would be more resources to support and help in the municipalities they move to. But the phenomenon of social dumping is more problematic than that. It means that a person who has difficulties, which is often the case, is moved or moves through active participation to another municipality, which often has poorer conditions for helping the person to create an independent life. As my colleague was touching upon, it is very difficult to make assessments about this, because we do not know everything we would like to know. But in most cases, one fares worse because one is moved from a wealthier municipality to a municipality with higher unemployment and poorer economic conditions. That is, to be completely clear, often where there are housing.

It means that this is not something positive for the individual. One is not moved to a municipality where it is easier to get a job or where the conditions are better for creating an independent life, but precisely the opposite. This is, therefore, a problem in itself. That is why we request measures to stop social dumping.

Not only during this debate but also in previous debates, the Minister for Civil Affairs has referred to the fact that this is very much about newcomers. I cannot argue against it because we do not know enough. But the picture I get is not that this is a problem that would disappear just because the number of newcomers decreases. This also affects people with difficulties in general. I am well aware that the number of newcomers is lower now because we Social Democrats turned that policy and reduced the number who came to Sweden. But I do not believe that this will mean that the phenomenon of social dumping will disappear.

I also think it is important that what has been raised looks different. A municipality can receive very many of one or the other each year. It is a bit about how the spotlight is set. It also means that this is difficult to plan.

I also want to bring up the children in my final words. This also affects children, and it is difficult for them.

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Peter Hedberg (S)

Mr. Speaker! I think what Eva Lindh says at the end is very important: It is actually about children and about people. We have highlighted the municipalities' problems and perspectives, because those are the voices we hear through our contacts with politicians. But it is clear that the biggest problem, ultimately, is not the communication between two municipal buildings in different municipalities, but that it is actually people who are affected by this issue. I believe we are in agreement on that.

Regarding whether this mostly applies to newcomers or not, we can state that we perhaps do not know enough to be able to draw any definitive conclusions. But I hear and have seen in mappings that Boverket has done – I believe Hem & Hyra also report on this – that it also concerns people exposed to violence and persons with substance abuse issues. This is, therefore, a multifaceted problem.

I feel that the government has wasted a year by scrapping the investigation that was supposed to look at measures against social dumping. I reiterate what I said in my previous post: Sure, knowledge can be good, but now we have retreated to the step where we were approximately three years ago.

I intend to continue living on hope, the hope that the Minister for Civil Affairs expressed on the first spring day in March, and pose this question: Is the government prepared to appoint a new commission of inquiry to investigate possible measures to counteract social dumping?

This is my last post, so I must thank you very much for the debate. I will be listening very carefully for a hopeful announcement from the Minister for Civil Affairs.

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Statsrådet Erik Slottner (KD)

Mr. Speaker! Even though it is March, I have not lost my senses completely, and I must still hold myself a bit to the forms and, not least, to the truth. This means that I will not, here and now, promise any new investigation of this. We have now assigned a task to the county administrative boards in the regulatory letter. Strictly speaking, it is no investigation, but it is still an analysis of the extent. We want to get clarity on this, and it means that the government sees that there is a problem, because otherwise, we would not be giving this assignment.

It is very possible that things will also emerge there that we do not already know, as quite a lot has happened during the past years. Against the background of the reduced refugee reception, it could also be that the phenomenon has decreased and that the majority now consists of groups other than just newly arrived. In that case, it can be good to know that ahead of any future measures.

I am not saying that the problem is not multifaceted, but the reports that have come so far and also the investigation, which did manage to do some of its work, showed that the majority were still newcomers and that it was many times precisely quota refugees who were placed in municipalities other than the settlement municipality. This was shown by the investigation. I met the investigator before the investigation was closed, and what I could ascertain then was that all the proposals that had managed to come in were outside my portfolio and outside my ministerial area. Much of it lay with the social services.

It should also be said that it has been difficult for me as Minister for Civil Affairs to proceed with any referral to the Council on Legislation or government bill in this area. I know that it was Lena Micko, who was then Minister for Civil Affairs, who commissioned the investigation itself.

It should also be mentioned that the government has returned with a new homelessness strategy, where they emphasize, among other things, housing first as a very important measure. They also allocate a considerable amount of funds so that the municipalities can work with this concept. I hope that this can be a small answer to what we do to facilitate for the municipalities to handle this issue better.

Regarding the tax equalization committee, it is stated that one is free to propose whatever measures one wishes. Should the committee wish to propose measures to compensate the municipalities for the occurrence of social dumping, one is therefore free to do so. This is not a recommendation from me that one should do so, but I am simply stating that one is free to do so.

I do not, however, claim that this is a way to escape the phenomenon of social dumping, but it is rather a way to economically compensate the municipalities that are exposed to it. It is therefore not a measure to escape the phenomenon itself, and I have never claimed that either.

Then it is only to be noted that it is an inherent conflict that we recognize from some other contexts, that where there are housing, it becomes more difficult with integration, because there is often a shortage of jobs, and where there are many jobs, it is often very difficult to get a housing. This is an inherent conflict for newcomers but not just for newcomers but also for those newly moved in in general, as well as for students and others. Where there are good opportunities for establishment, one still lacks perhaps the most fundamental establishment opportunity, namely a roof over one's head and a home. This is an inherent conflict that we do not solve here and now, even though it happens to be March.

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Eva Lindh (S)

Mr. Speaker! It is very good with housing first, but then there must also be housing to move into. This was my point about us now having a housing crisis. Too few homes are being built, and it is very worrying.

I do not want to seem pushy. But I still want to give a picture of what it is about, because there may be people listening to the debate who need to know what it concerns. I heard about a child who lived with their single mother. They felt forced to move to another municipality to get the support they are actually entitled to. That naturally involved great difficulties in many different ways. It can also mean breakups from friends, family, and loved ones. I just want to describe how much it affects the people who are subjected to this.

I think it is a pity - and I have lamented it before - that the investigation was not allowed to continue. Even if the county administrative boards now receive a mandate, we could have learned from the investigation how things look, what decisions we must make, and on what grounds. We would also have received proposals for initiatives or measures to de facto stop social dumping. I truly hope that we can get there and that we can together find proposals to stop this unworthy thing that is happening in Sweden today.

Many thanks for the debate!

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Statsrådet Erik Slottner (KD)

Mr. Speaker! Let me thank Eva Lindh for once again raising this issue. We have debated it a number of times in this chamber, and we will surely have reason to return to it, I guess, during the remainder of the mandate period.

I have, as I have said, not much more to answer now than I have given the times we have debated the issue so far. What is new since last time is, above all, the assignment I have given to the county administrative boards to further analyze the issue and report back to the government on the extent of the phenomenon.

Since then, some other measures have also been taken at the Ministry of Social Affairs regarding a homelessness strategy. We also look forward to a new Social Services Act. I cannot say today whether it will in any way affect these parts. But as said, it is very possible that the government will return with more measures regarding this issue. It is nothing I can give notice on here and now.

The interpellations debate was hereby concluded.

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