Response to interpellation 2023/24:623 on limiting children's access to violent pornography online
Translated from Swedish by AI; the translation may contain errors. The Swedish text is the original.
Summary AI, written in advance
The debate concerns the limitation of children's access to violent pornography online. M argues that protection is regulated through the Radio and Television Act and the EU's DSA Regulation, which is a good regulatory framework for a safer online environment. M emphasizes the importance of protecting children from violence online 1 and that the Swedish Media Council has an important responsibility for supervision and promotional work 1. M believes that legislation exists through the DSA Regulation 1 and that the issue requires a broad approach with work on several fronts 2. S argues that children have access to violent pornography which leads to increased strangulation violence and requests specific legislation 3 4.
Written by AI in advance and may contain errors. The numbers lead to the speech a statement builds on; check against the text below.
Kulturministern Parisa Liljestrand (M)
Madam Speaker! Åsa Eriksson has asked the Minister for Civil Affairs what measures he intends to take to reduce children's and young people's access to violent and female-degrading pornography online.
The work within the government is distributed in such a way that it is I who shall answer the interpellation.
Issues concerning children and young people fall under several ministers, and within my area of responsibility lie measures against harmful media influence.
The Media Authority has, according to its instruction, to work to strengthen children and young people as conscious media users and to work to protect children from harmful media influence.
In the Radio and Television Act, there are rules regarding the protection of children for both radio and television, but also for so-called video-sharing platforms, which current platforms are considered to be. According to the Radio and Television Act, a provider of a video-sharing platform shall take appropriate measures so that content containing realistic depictions of violence or pornographic images is not provided in such a way that there is a significant risk that children can see this, unless it is nevertheless justifiable for special reasons. Such measures may consist of introducing age or parental control systems as well as systems for users to be able to flag and report certain content. The Swedish MediaลAuthority has supervision over that the providers take such measures.
The EU's regulation on a single market for digital services, the so-called DSA Regulation, has been fully applicable since February 17 of this year. The regulation contains, among other things, rules on the handling of illegal content. It also contains requirements that certain platforms, for example video-sharing platforms, shall introduce measures to ensure a high level of privacy, security, and safety for minors.
In addition to these requirements, the very large platform companies shall assess the risks their activities entail based on a number of different aspects, one of which is negative effects for minors. They shall then take measures to mitigate the risks that have been identified. This may involve introducing age or parental controls and tools to help minors report abuse.
The Medical Products Agency has been given the primary supervisory responsibility regarding the rules on the protection of minors in the DSA Regulation. This supervisory responsibility covers providers of intermediation services under Swedish jurisdiction.
The type of content that Åsa Eriksson describes can largely be assumed to be found on the very largest intermediary services, which are not monitored nationally but directly by the European Commission. When it concerns content that is noticed by users in Sweden but on such platforms that fall under the Commission's or another Member State's supervisory responsibility, it will be the Swedish Post and Telecom Authority, PTS, which by virtue of being the national coordinator for the DSA, has the mandate to be the link to the Commission or the other Member State in order to contribute to compliance with the rules in the DSA if necessary. The Media Authority will provide expert support to PTS in such cases.
Åsa Eriksson (S)
Madam Speaker! I thank the Minister for the answer.
It is less than a month since we debated the exact same subject. I was not satisfied with the answer I received then, and therefore I submitted a similar interpellation to Justice Minister Gunnar Strömmer to ask if the government intends to introduce any legislation to limit minors' access to violent pornography online. Then I received the answer that I should pose the question to Civil Minister Slottner, and I did so. And now the question has been handed over to the Minister for Culture. Nothing wrong with the Minister for Culture - it is pleasant to debate with the Minister for Culture - but I expect no answer from the Minister for Culture regarding new legislation. But I hope I am wrong.
Madam Speaker! This is an incredibly important issue. Just as we established less than a month ago, virtually all children and young people in Sweden today have access to violent pornography on their computers, tablets, and phones. We know that pornography consumption is increasing and moving down in age, and we know that mainstream pornography is becoming increasingly violent and that torture is commonly occurring.
Madam Speaker! To be clear: Pornography is not sex. The violent, women-degrading pornography shows filmed gang rapes, gross sexual assaults, and the humiliation of women. It is the total opposite of equality and the equal value of all people, which we are working for.
Madam Speaker! Last autumn, the Gender Equality Authority presented a report stating that twice as many girls and young women who have been killed in a partner relationship have been strangled to death compared to women over 25 years old.
What is the reason for this, one might ask. The Minister's colleague, Minister for Equality Paulina Brandberg, says that she sees a close connection between young people's unlimited access to violence porn and the increased strangulation violence. Researchers are right - more and more young boys are porn-damaged today, unfortunately, and it also has effects on the people in their vicinity.
The Minister for Equality says that she wants to limit children's access to violence pornography. The Government has tasked the National Board for Forensic Medicine with conducting a mapping of strangulation violence so that more people can be convicted. That is good.
The Minister's colleague says in an interview: "We have been blind to youth's pornography consumption and how it affects them in their relationships." Yes, I say, and what does the government intend to do about it?
The Social Democratic government tasked the Children's Ombudsman in 2020 to map existing knowledge, from both research and actors who encounter children and young people, based on the Convention on the Rights of the Child, regarding how and where children consume or are exposed to pornography.
Madam Speaker! We heard in the Minister's response that there are authorities that are to monitor whether platforms that show harmful content take measures or not, so I want to ask the Minister if she has received any reports from the Swedish Post and Telecom Authority regarding whether Pornhub has taken any measures.
Kulturministern Parisa Liljestrand (M)
Madam Speaker! Yes, a slight sense of déjà vu - I must apologize to Åsa Eriksson for her being dragged in with me even in this interpellation debate. But just as I said in the previous debate and will do even in this one, it is the case that both the physical and mental health and well-being of children and young people is something that cuts across many different departments. It is also why such a question bounces between the departments and is eventually filtered down to me when it concerns safety online and the authority in question lies with me. But it is clear that one can cut the question in many different ways.
The committee member himself mentioned the assignment that the government has given to the National Board of Forensic Medicine. It is a step in trying to both map out and compile the existing knowledge on specifically strangulation in order to see how, when it occurs in a sexual context, we can better ensure that we counteract it and assess the risks associated with it. It is one thing the government is doing right now.
The member also mentioned the assignment that was given to the Children's Ombudsman under the previous government. The Children's Ombudsman stated that evaluations were lacking for several of the filters used in many schools.
The question of age verification has also been looked into. That question lies with my colleague at the Ministry of Justice. We know that it is problematic even within that framework, as it actually involves constitutional amendments that would be required. One is covered by the freedom of expression act, the prohibition of censorship, and other things that complicate this.
Regarding the legislation that the member is requesting, I refer again to the DSA, which has actually been fully used since the middle of February, even in Sweden, and which is a good regulation that also takes place at the EU level. The idea with that regulation is to create a safer online environment by ensuring that there is a regulatory framework but also requirements for the handling of illegal content on digital platforms.
Regarding the member's question about whether any reports have reached me, it is nothing that I can answer today. I can, of course, find out what the situation is with that reporting, but it is nothing that has reached me personally yet regarding this.
Åsa Eriksson (S)
Madam Speaker! I would like to thank the Minister, because I still perceive that there is a sincere will to actually answer the questions. For me as an interpellant, it is pleasing, so I thank you very much for that and hope that together we can find ways to make a difference in practice.
This is a very big problem for many people. Even if they require constitutional amendments, I mean that we need to look at it, because we cannot let several generations of children and young people get a completely skewed and distorted picture of what sexual relations are about and become porn-damaged. It is a betrayal against both boys and girls, I mean - against everyone who is affected by this. Then we as adults cannot just watch and say that it is too difficult, but we have a responsibility to actually do something about it.
Madam Speaker! The global porn sites act systematically to normalize sexual violence. It is tragic, but that is how it is. Even if there may initially be a resistance in the viewer against seeing this gross violence, one immediately gets an indication when watching that this is completely normal. Directly under the clips, one sees how many others have watched this and given a thumbs up and liked it. One is thus lulled into a belief that this is normal, even though it is not.
Madam Speaker! As I pointed out in our previous debate, there are amounts of staff already in primary school who are sounding the alarm that the tone in the language and the attitude towards girls has become more degrading and that this stems from increased porn viewing. School counselors and school nurses are desperate that young girls believe they must agree to anal sex, group sex, and strangulation sex to be considered normal and attractive. More and more girls seek help at youth centers for pain and injuries in connection with violent sex, which they believe is normal sex. We cannot let this destructive development continue.
Madam Speaker! When we had this debate last time, I handed over a book, The Big Book of Porn, to the Minister. I wonder if it provided any new insights and if the Minister intends to follow what is proposed in the book: to do more to limit children's access to pornography.
Even though the DSA Regulation is quite new, I wonder when the Minister expects that regulation to take effect.
Kulturministern Parisa Liljestrand (M)
Madam Speaker! I will begin with the member's final question, that is, when the DSA will take effect.
I naturally hope that it will have an effect immediately. That is why we have the regulation. We see the need to regulate this within the framework of EU cooperation, because we see that it is not just a national problem. It concerns large online platforms where much of this content is spread in various ways, and one needs legislation that extends beyond national borders to be able to address the problems.
That is also why it is written in the regulation that online platforms with more than 45 million users per month fall under the European Commission's supervisory responsibility. It is a way to ensure that when working with the large platforms, there is a counterparty that can obtain an overview from several nations so that one is not bound by national borders and can advocate for, in this case, Europe as a whole. In that way, one can also be a bit tougher on this issue.
My expectation is, naturally, that since the regulation has come into force as of the middle of February, it will also be able to have an effect. The regulation itself will, however, not solve any problems; rather, this is based on us also seeing that this is a widespread problem and that it is necessary to work on several different fronts. That is why I am clear that the government's work in this issue cuts across different departments and is based on us looking at both mapping to understand the issues, education, legislation, and work not only in Sweden but also within the framework of the EU, in order to ultimately be able to protect children and young people from harmful media influence.
This is based on the fact that one must have a broad approach when the issue is handled. It is also an issue that concerns children and young people being exposed to both violence porn and other harmful things online. I believe that we generally in society need to conduct a broader debate about what children and young people are exposed to and how, with the help of both the state's and society's power, we can address the problems that we know exist in the online world and which our children and young people today, whether they want to or not, become a part of.
Actions will be required at both the state and societal level and at both the national level and EU level, as well as government work that cuts across the different departments. The government needs to work collectively to be able to create power and effect when it comes to countering harmful media influence.
Åsa Eriksson (S)
Madam Speaker! I agree with the Minister that one really needs to work broadly on both this and many other issues. There is not just one thing that solves the problem. This is one of the reasons why we Social Democrats, when we were in government, also ensured that changes were made to the curriculum and teacher education, because one needs to obtain increased knowledge, and appointed the inquiries and so on.
But unfortunately, enlightenment and knowledge are not enough, and I mean that legislation is also needed. Legislation was also one of the tools that the minister himself mentioned.
When we met here last time, I spoke about the United Kingdom and their Online Safety Act, which was adopted last year. There, an obligation is placed on pornography sites to verify that users are over 18 years old. I want to ask if the Minister is prepared to take the initiative for similar legislation in Sweden, if one sees that the DSA does not achieve this effect.
Kulturministern Parisa Liljestrand (M)
Madam Speaker! I shall return to the fundamental question that the member posed, that is, what measures I intend to take to reduce children's and young people's access to violent and female-degrading pornography on the internet. I think it is important that we have the same basic value going into this: We see the seriousness of the issue and understand the need to protect children and young people from all forms of violence, so also on the internet.
There are a number of ongoing efforts and measures within the framework of the government's work. Within the framework of my department and my work, the Media Authority has an incredibly important responsibility when it comes to protection against harmful media influence, both through supervision and through promotional work, naturally; I have touched upon that earlier. One can also now make use of the DSA Regulation when it comes to protecting minors under Swedish jurisdiction.
The members of the board are requesting legislation. Legislation has been put in place with the regulation, which began to apply from the middle of February. Now we need to see how this turns out and how it can be utilized within the framework of both Sweden's and the EU Commission's work.
The government will, of course, return regarding the other parts, where we also have work underway, for this is an issue that needs to be handled in its entirety, just as we both have been involved in.
I cannot answer questions regarding whether there will be more or other legislation, but for those, I need to refer you to my colleague at the Ministry of Justice. One should perhaps not tip each other off on how interpellations should be written, but I believe that if the interpellor tries to specify their question a bit more towards legislation, there might be a greater chance that the Minister of Justice answers.
Source: The Swedish Parliament. The speeches come from the open data of the Riksdag, translated into English by AI, which may contain errors.