Response to interpellation 2023/24:91 on rural area conditions

Landsbygdsministern Peter Kullgren (KD)

Madam Speaker! [The member] has asked me in what way I intend to work to reverse urbanization and increase the supply of skills as part of strengthening the conditions for Sweden's rural areas and if I am open to investigating, testing, and evaluating new measures in order to achieve this.

The development of the countryside is crucial for the success of the whole of Sweden. Here, the government has a unified focus: The whole of Sweden shall function. The conditions for living, residing, and working in the entire country need to be improved.

The conditions in rural areas differ in different parts of the country, which requires different measures and different solutions. To achieve the goal of rural policy, a breadth of measures across many policy areas is therefore needed.

It is not a completely unambiguous picture that emerges regarding migration patterns within the kingdom. While some large urban municipalities have had a negative domestic migration net, many rural municipalities have simultaneously had a positive one. This trend was particularly clear during the pandemic years. That being said, it differs greatly for different rural municipalities, where many municipalities have had a declining population. This development, together with a large need for labor with the right skills, is a major challenge for the skill supply.

There must be access to healthcare, school, care, and culture throughout the entire country. Competence supply and the opportunities for competence development shall be promoted, which is of importance for both the business sector and the welfare.

Digital connectivity is important in rural areas. Digitalization provides increased opportunities for remote work and remote studies, which can lead to an increased recruitment base in sparsely populated and rural areas. This presupposes fast broadband, where the differences between sparsely populated and densely populated areas continue to decrease.

In order to meet the continued large skills needs throughout Sweden, enable the transition of the business sector and society, and promote matching in the labor market, the government has in the budget bill 2024, among other things, proposed that a total of over 1.7 billion kronor be allocated to strengthen regional vocational adult education and vocational higher education.

Additional funds are also proposed to be invested in transition study support, which, like validation, are important tools for transition and skills development. Several different initiatives on education and research that are to strengthen the engineering nation Sweden are also being made to meet the large skills needs.

In the rural areas, the car is important for traveling to both work, education, and services as well as to cultural and leisure activities. During 2024, the tax on gasoline and diesel is lowered, and during 2025, the tax on gasoline is lowered further. The extended reduction of the tax on so-called agricultural diesel is extended during 2024. The Government also proposes a reduction of the reduction obligation to 6 percent for gasoline and diesel from and including January 1, 2024. It is also important to maintain accessibility and ensure a reliable infrastructure. The Government continues to prioritize funds for strengthened road maintenance, including the private road network.

These are a few examples of areas in which the government is making investments, which contribute to strengthening the conditions in rural areas and thus the supply of skills throughout the country. The government also continuously monitors the development of Sweden's rural areas and the implementation of rural policy. This follow-up and current societal changes form the basis for the government's development of rural policy so that it leads to strengthened conditions to live, reside, and work in the entire country.

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Eric Palmqvist (SD)

Madam Speaker! I thank the Minister for the answer to my interpellation. This interpellation debate will not be as confrontational from my side as it perhaps will be from the others who have signed up for it.

I note that the Minister highlights several good things that we within the Tidösamarbetet do together to compensate for, among other things, the misconduct that Miljöpartiet and Socialdemokraterna have engaged in during previous parliamentary terms. But I still want to dwell for a while on the competence supply and the measures and ideas that are needed to move forward and solve the situation outside our major metropolitan regions. For that is how it is: Sweden consists largely of countryside - in one way or another, depending on how one defines it. We have major metropolitan regions, and then we have the countryside.

During the debate, I will make some observations concerning Norrbotten. I do know, however, that the situation is very similar in many other places, regardless of whether one ends up in Kronoberg, in Jämtland, in Värmland, or in some similar region.

We all pay tax and expect to receive a social service for it. But if we look at the situation in Norrbotten, we can state that there is a shortage of doctors, dentists, nurses, teachers, vehicle inspection staff, county veterinarians, social workers, driving examiners and so on. There is also a shortage of qualified labor for the industry. It is a major problem if people do not feel that they can live and reside in their home regions because the social service does not function.

I believe that the models we have had for subsidies, tax breaks, grants and so on have reached the end of the road. We must start looking at other solutions. That is the point I want to take in this debate: It is time to start thinking outside the box.

We have had ideas that have been rejected by the Social Democrats, for example, and which we have also had to abandon because we have a joint budget cooperation with M, KD and L. I do not even think that one reform is enough. I believe that a series of reforms are needed to change the trend and move forward. Ultimately, this issue is about whether it will be possible to live and reside in the whole country and also the self-image for those people who choose to do so. If one is seen as a recipient of benefits or someone who needs support, one loses in pride and does not feel the same sense of belonging as if one sees that one manages to live on one's own ability, so to speak.

That can also be done, for example in Norrbotten. There are fantastic riches and the like there, but not all the profits and all the benefits end up there. It is a problem that is inherited and which concerns how the tax system is structured at its core. This stems from a time when it was thought to be sufficient that those who worked in the mine, the forest, or the industry paid municipal tax. Today, they often do not live in the same municipality, and fewer people work in industry. Therefore, the tax revenues are lower even though the production is still very high.

This is, therefore, mostly an appeal for us to join forces, think outside the box, come up with new solutions and work for what we have as a common goal. I am completely convinced that our objectives are fairly similar.

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Linus Sköld (S)

Madam Speaker! I would like to begin by thanking Eric Palmqvist for an important question: Are there creative solutions to the problems in rural areas? I think it is a superbly posed question. It is just a pity that the debate here will be about everything other than creative solutions. A large part of the problems listed in the interpellation and which are touched upon in the Minister's answer are based on the collective right-wing structural rationalization of the social contract.

Let me explain. Eric Palmqvist gives a few examples in his interpellation: education, dental care, healthcare, vehicle inspection, and veterinary services. One can continue the list of deregulated and privatized activities with pharmacies, broadband, railway maintenance, road maintenance, school, retail, employment services, and preschool - it never ends.

The only way for the Right to push through its tax cuts is to streamline these operations. Deregulations and privatizations are based on a market basis, and the market, as is well known, thrives best where there are many and purchasing-power-strong customers. One can then ask why these deregulated and privatized operations, which are conducted on a market basis, do not deliver service where people live sparsely. I would like to hear Eric Palmqvist answer the question: Which of the listed operations, which are now managed with efficiency and operated on a market basis, does Eric Palmqvist think should be re-regulated and managed by values other than efficiency?

By the way, Kullgren can answer the same question: Are there activities and services that the social contract, simply by being a citizen of the country and paying tax, should provide access to regardless of whether one lives in a city or in rural areas? In that case, Kullgren should also be in favor of re-regulating a number of the listed activities.

This is my contribution to this debate. I think it could truly be about creative solutions. How are we going to ensure that there is equal access to medicines throughout the country? How are we going to ensure that the railway maintenance, road maintenance, and the school system function throughout the country?

(Applause)

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Kristoffer Lindberg (S)

Madam Speaker! In this debate, I would like to highlight the conditions of the countryside in light of the question of the long-term financing of welfare linked to the different municipalities' conditions.

The need to strengthen municipalities' economic conditions to provide an equal welfare across the entire country remains great. The Swedish welfare rests on the shoulders of the municipalities. Preschool, primary school, upper secondary school, adult education, home nursing, elderly care, social assistance, culture and leisure for children and young people, libraries and a part of road maintenance are just a few examples of the municipal responsibility.

These activities are financed primarily by the municipal tax and to some extent by state grants. Although the conditions look very different between municipalities with regard to geography, demography, and tax base, all municipalities have the same responsibility to deliver these social functions to their inhabitants. It is fundamentally good, Madam Speaker. Welfare should, after all, look the same. Regardless of where you live, you have the right to the same access to welfare.

We can, however, observe that the differences between the municipalities' conditions are still great. We can, for example, look at job opportunities, which to an ever-increasing extent are concentrated in the larger cities and their surrounding municipalities. At the same time, the need for welfare is many times greater in the municipalities where the tax base is lower, partly as a result of out-migration and an aging population.

This leads to great challenges. With an ever-decreasing tax base and higher costs, one must manage to deliver the residents' needs for welfare. If we want a society that holds together, it is not reasonable that residents in certain municipalities gradually have to pay more and more municipal tax to receive the welfare they can expect, while the opposite applies in other municipalities, not least around our larger cities.

My question to the Minister is therefore: Does the Minister see that the state can take a greater responsibility than today to create a more equal distribution of resources and meet the entire country's needs for welfare?

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Isak From (S)

Madam Speaker! The Minister, Minister for Rural Affairs Peter Kullgren, and I had a similar debate nearly two weeks ago. The answers do not differ much. At that time, there was also some accounting regarding support for rural shops and things that are not really included here. Otherwise, the Minister places great emphasis on the reduction in petrol and diesel tax and the reduction of the reduction obligation that the government is now making. These largely benefit the metropolitan areas.

One could have done exactly as the Minister says in his answer here regarding the need for different measures in different parts of the country. One could have advantageously done as the Social Democrats and directed support to those living in the countryside. With Social Democratic policy, they would receive direct support, which we know would not be eaten up by either world market prices or the large gasoline and diesel companies.

Is it a direct support to those who actually need it, or is it a support to the metropolitan areas? It is clear what the Tidö parties prioritize. It is the support to the metropolitan areas.

In that debate, I also raised an important issue that actually makes life worth living, not least in the inland of Norrland. It is the activities of the study associations. It is ABF and Studieförbundet Vuxenskolan that make it possible for courses to be held to obtain snowmobile licenses, jet ski licenses, and AM licenses. One can take a course in sheep shearing, potato cultivation, and languages such as English and French. People who actually move from Central Europe to Norsjö or Lycksele are given the opportunity through the activities of the study associations to enter society and understand what it is like to live and reside in the inland of Norrland. But the Tidö parties are to cut back heavily on that.

It is also the study associations that enable other cultural activities, such as Norrlandsoperan, Norrbottensteatern or other activities, to reach the population in the whole country, even the small municipalities. It is a quite large difference.

I still see nothing in the government's budget that points towards a decentralization that would enable greater flexibility, greater capacity for action, and an ability for municipalities and regions across the country to make their own decisions. When one looks at the whole and the inquiries that this government appoints, one sees rather a centralization policy.

It is a focus on urban culture. It is a focus on healthcare being centralized. There is also a greater focus on the privatizations that have been carried out and which make it more difficult to get a registration inspection if you live in Malå. The availability of registration inspections is small. To inspect a heavy trailer that one is to tow behind their timber truck, many have to travel very many miles, sometimes 60 miles round trip. Is that a sustainable business climate? It is not, naturally.

These are differences that exist in Sweden today.

(Applause)

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Landsbygdsministern Peter Kullgren (KD)

Madam Speaker! A message that I want to send with this debate concerns this issue of urbanization. It is no longer such a clear tendency as it was previously. There is a false image in the general debate of dying rural areas and that the large cities have an unwavering pull. It is not true.

When Sifo asks the Swedes what their dream home is, 28 percent answer the countryside. 14 percent answer the archipelago, and 12 percent answer the big city. And when you ask young people how they would most like to live if they were allowed to dream completely freely without any limitations whatsoever, the most popular answer is: a manor house in the Swedish countryside. Only half as many prefer a grand apartment in Stockholm's city center. The countryside thus has a great attraction.

As mentioned, there is also no net migration to Stockholm from the rest of the country, but rather the opposite. In recent years, more people have chosen to move away from Stockholm than to Stockholm. Every week, the equivalent of two to three busloads of families now leave Stockholm County to settle in the rest of the country.

Many rural municipalities have also had a positive domestic net migration. That trend was particularly clear during the pandemic years. That tells us something important. If we create opportunities for people to stay in or move to the countryside, more people will do so. But then the countryside must not become the scapegoat when we carry out the transitions that we need to make.

That is why the reduction of the reduction obligation is important for the government. It is an important example that this government stands up for agriculture and forestry. In some places, those industries are so important and many times the basis for entrepreneurship and the jobs in the Swedish countryside.

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Eric Palmqvist (SD)

Madam Speaker! Thank you, Minister, for the answers we have received so far!

I agree that there is a false image of the countryside. It might be heard in the dialect that I am a Malmö boy who has moved to the inland of Norrbotten. I am, therefore, one of those who have moved in exactly that direction. If I move away from there, it will not be because I think it is bad to live in the countryside. It might be because schooling is not as it should be, because it is not possible to recruit teachers. It is also not possible to recruit nurses. Dental care also functions poorly.

I am not a minister, but I still received a question here. It becomes a bit strange when one applies that order. Some order must be maintained within a party, as some minister said. This perhaps also applies to a party that supports al-Fatah and considers it a sister party.

When it comes to support and the like, one has heard: support, support and again support. It is precisely that which I experience is the problem. One views the countryside as something depleting that is in need of support. In reality, masses are produced in the countryside that the country lives well on.

It is about the fact that new models are needed. I am not saying that I have the answer key for this. If I had, we would have solved it, and everything would have been settled. But that is not the case.

But there are still things that can be noted. One example is dental care. Today we have a system where private dentists choose to have expensive premises in Stockholm. They do not have full lists, but they could have had them if they were established in, for example, Malmfälten. It is not about needing support for them, but it is about how the compensation models that have existed for decades are designed. Somewhere it is wrong when one chooses to establish themselves where it is already over-established. It is not about needing support, but about creating incentives that make it profitable to operate even in the countryside. There must be a pull-factor towards there.

We have proposed a regionalized property tax for industrial properties and power production facilities. I believe it would be fantastically good. Many Norrland counties would gain a lot from it, but most regions would go into the plus. I am open to a review of whether it was a successful reform to move the regional development responsibility from the county administrative boards to the regions. I am one of those who believe it was a bad reform, but I do not say with certainty that it would change anything in essence if it were changed back.

There are a number of different factors that must be looked at in this. I believe we have reached the end of the road when it comes to only adjusting with support and looking at some differentiated fees. I believe we must do much and many things at the same time. All credit to those of us who have succeeded in pushing through a reduction of the reduction obligation! We have high ambitions when it comes to expanding fiber and so on, but it is not the entire solution. There is much else that is needed so that one can take part in what we collectively pay via the tax bill, regardless of whether one lives on the Småland highlands, in the interior of Norrbotten, or in the Värmland forests.

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Linus Sköld (S)

Madam Speaker! Eric Palmqvist and I are participating in the same debate, and he is part of the party group in this chamber that holds the reins of that government. Therefore, he must actually tolerate me requesting his views as well.

I think one can sense from Eric Palmqvist's latest post in the debate that he thinks dental care can be regulated, that is, that one can control how the establishment of new dental care is to take place, and that he also thinks broadband expansion can possibly be regulated, since he has the ambition to expand it even where the population is sparse. That should mean that one should not have to do it on a market basis. Those were the two embryos of answers that I think Eric Palmqvist gave. Otherwise, he gave irrelevant comments about our sister parties.

I think the minister ignored my questions about whether there is any of all the activities I listed – pharmacies, broadband, railway maintenance, road maintenance, healthcare, elderly care, personal assistance, school, electricity retail, vehicle inspection, employment services, preschool, and dental care – that the minister thinks it would be worth regulating, so that the social contract holds even for those living in rural areas. Then one can get an appointment at the vehicle inspection, get hold of expensive medicines that the deregulated pharmacy market does not want to stock, or get care in time. Is there any of these activities that Peter Kullgren would think it was important to steer more firmly so that the social contract holds?

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Kristoffer Lindberg (S)

Madam Speaker! Does the Minister consider it reasonable that residents in rural areas and the countryside have to pay ever-increasing municipal taxes to receive the welfare they can expect, while the opposite applies in other municipalities where the tax base is high but the need for welfare may be lower? This inevitably leads to the gap between city and country being reinforced.

It is clear that society to a greater extent needs to take into account the increased costs resulting from sparseness and weaker socioeconomics and the challenge that exists in declining tax bases. The situation, of course, looks different in different municipalities, as the Minister also touched upon. I therefore reformulate my question. How does the Minister intend to work to create more equal conditions for the country's municipalities given the differing circumstances, while all municipalities have the same responsibility towards their inhabitants?

(Applause)

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Isak From (S)

Madam Speaker! Next time we have this debate, perhaps Peter Kullgren can add that the government is also working to strengthen local and regional governance.

There is a positive example that I would like to highlight, and that is R10. Ten municipalities in Västerbotten and Norrbotten now, in collaboration with Umeå University, enable police training at a distance. One should be able to live in Vilhelmina, Dorotea, Arvidsjaur, or Arjeplog and study part-time to become a police officer. This is because it has turned out to be very difficult for many to undergo a regular police training because, after the training, one first ends up somewhere else, in a metropolitan area. It has been very difficult to get police officers to stay, but it has now been made possible thanks to the initiative of local availability so that the municipalities themselves can control this. It is the opposite of a centralization policy where everything moves towards a larger part.

Northern Sweden has been blessed with both Linus Sköld and Eric Palmqvist. Northern Sweden is very grateful for it, and there is room for many more. Welcome to northern Sweden - that is where the future is!

One thing that the Minister for Rural Affairs can do something about is that the capital - the forest - is disappearing from northern Sweden. Large private wallets are buying up forest. I am talking about Akelius, for example, which buys large amounts of forest in a way that forestry companies have not been allowed to do, but which conducts forestry in the same way. It depletes regional ownership and removes capital from the countryside.

(Applause)

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Landsbygdsministern Peter Kullgren (KD)

Madam Speaker! It feels a bit as if one could have four or five different interpellations debates within this area. I naturally welcome the discussion, and the members are welcome to write more motions. I receive very few interpellations from Social Democrats. You are welcome to write, so that we can also delve deeper into individual topics in this important area, which is rural policy!

I intend to send back a question. What do the Social Democrats want to regulate? Why did the Social Democrats not re-regulate driving tests, pharmacies, and everything else that the member mentioned, during the eight years they led this country and sat in government? What did the Social Democrats re-regulate? Why is the question being asked now, after twelve and a half months, to this government?

Generally speaking, the Christian Democrats or any of the other government parties do not particularly believe that the state should rule everything and that everything will therefore become good. It is an ideological difference that we have. I am very curious as to why the Social Democrats did not regulate more, if that is the solution to all the problems in the countryside.

In order for it to be possible to live in the countryside, there must, of course, be access to services. It is completely central for all people. The municipalities are incredibly important service providers to the citizens. Therefore, the government also improves the conditions for municipalities and regions. We are increasing the general government grants by 10 billion SEK from 2024, and in addition to the general government grants, the government also allocates 6 billion SEK in targeted government grants to the municipal sector for the coming years. Altogether, it is an addition of nearly 16 billion SEK.

To strengthen the development capacity of municipalities, certain rural and countryside municipalities receive state grants. The state grant amounts to 675 million kronor for the period 2018-2027 to 30 municipalities with socio-economic challenges, primarily in rural areas. In addition, 510 million is provided during the period 2018-2024 to 39 municipalities, mainly in the inland of Norrland. These funds have, of course, been of great importance for the capacity to handle challenges, crises, and societal changes in municipalities characterized by long distances and small populations.

We also support from the government's side the development towards a close and accessible healthcare with a focus on primary care. To specifically strengthen healthcare in rural areas, the government is investing 300 million kronor annually between the years 2023 and 2025.

In order for it to be attractive to live in the countryside, there must also be accessibility to grocery stores and gas stations. It is of great importance for a robust society that functions in both everyday life and in a crisis. The Government therefore allocates funds annually to maintain commercial services. In 2023, this amount amounts to 162 million, and for 2024, the corresponding amount is estimated to be distributed.

I share the interpellator's commitment to the skills supply. We can allocate funds to welfare, but there must also be people with the right skills who can perform the tasks. Skills supply and skills development are therefore one of four strategic areas within the regional development policy for 2021-2030. The education offered within upper secondary schools and municipal adult education shall constitute a basis for the national and regional skills supply of the working life.

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ANDRE VICE TALMANNEN

I want to inform that the debaters from the Socialdemokraterna do not have the opportunity for further remarks and therefore cannot answer the questions today. This may happen in future interpellation debates.

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Eric Palmqvist (SD)

Madam Speaker! I thank the Minister for the answers given during the evening.

During the years I drove trucks in Sweden, I sometimes ended up in rural areas. There were small companies there that had large operations, an entrepreneurial spirit, and faith in the future. They were companies that did the most fantastic things that one had hardly heard about. As an example, we can take Aimpoint in Gällivare, which exports red dot sights all over the world.

I believe in a countryside where conditions are provided for people to grow. What I hear from the other side of politics is about regulation. If talk is had about reviewing the regulatory framework for compensation to dentists, it is interpreted as a desire to regulate. They talk about taxes and subsidies. They do not say anything about the values that are produced staying where they are.

Speaking for this is a meeting earlier this year when we discussed our proposal regarding a regionalization of the property tax. At that time, the Social Democratic spinal reflex was: It is the state's money! It is we who should have the money! One is, therefore, not open to seeing that the model we have today stems from a time when there were many people working at the mills, the mill owner basically lived next to the mill, and people did not commute to work. One is not open to looking at another model. I am not saying that our proposed model is the best, but I am saying that something other than what we have now was needed. The spinal reflex from the Social Democrats, however, is regulation, taxes, and subsidies. I hope that together with the other Tidö parties, we can come up with sensible proposals to solve this issue.

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Landsbygdsministern Peter Kullgren (KD)

Madam Speaker! When the government took office, we charted a path forward with a clear prioritization of the all too often overlooked countryside. The formation of the cohesive Ministry of Rural Affairs and Infrastructure is an initial example of this. The new ministry has many issues that relate to one another and are crucial for Sweden beyond our three largest cities. This concerns issues of rural development, regional development, infrastructure, housing and social planning, but also agriculture and forestry. By gathering these issues in one and the same ministry, the government wants to show that these are issues that should be prioritized.

The government, of course, continuously monitors the development of Sweden's rural areas and the implementation of rural policy. This is done, among other things, through various indicators reported in the budget bill but also in other assignments, for example, the systematic follow-up that Tillväxtverket carries out. That agency also has a mandate to work with methodological support for rural analysis and impact assessments for operations within the state agencies. Tillväxtverket shall also follow current research, analyses, and evaluations within the rural area.

At the Ministry of Rural Affairs and Infrastructure, a review of the overall rural policy has been initiated. The purpose is for us to present proposals to strengthen the conditions for rural areas. In that work, I welcome all proposals, new and old, regarding solutions and measures, because the development of rural areas is crucial for all of Sweden to have continued success. Thank you for the debate!

The interpellations debate was hereby concluded.

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