Response to interpellation 2022/23:325 on security interests in Gotland
Translated from Swedish by AI; the translation may contain errors. The Swedish text is the original.
Summary AI, written in advance
The debate concerned security interests in the procurement of the ferry traffic to Gotland. KD emphasized Gotland's strategic location and the need for secure transport for the Försvarsmakten as well as supplies for the civilian population 1. KD argued that Trafikverket should carry out a security-protected procurement in consultation with Försvarsmakten 2. KD assumed that Trafikverket follows the security requirements and was open to strengthening the security culture in regulatory letters 3. S emphasized the importance of security culture and suggested that the government should set requirements in regulatory letters 4 5. S also proposed a model with state tonnage to raise the security level and lower capital costs 5. S requested a clearer commitment from the government regarding regulatory letters and long-term solutions for own tonnage 6.
Written by AI in advance and may contain errors. The numbers lead to the speech a statement builds on; check against the text below.
Statsrådet Andreas Carlson (KD)
Madam Speaker! Peter Hultqvist has asked the Minister for Defence what initiatives he is prepared to take to safeguard defense and security interests in connection with the procurement of the ferry traffic Visby-Nynäshamn and Visby-Oskarshamn. The work within the government is distributed such that it is I who shall answer the interpellation.
The security policy situation in Sweden's immediate vicinity and in Europe means that issues regarding preparedness and total defense are in focus. Gotland's strategic location in the Baltic Sea cannot be overestimated, and the ferry traffic that the state procures via Trafikverket is of great importance for both the individual traveler and for the total defense. Particularly important is the Armed Forces' need for secure and smooth transport of military materiel and personnel to and from the island, as well as securing necessary supplies of goods to the civilian population and materiel to be able to ensure the most important societal functions on the island.
Trafikverket shall, in its role as a contracting authority, taking into account the applicable procurement regulations, set the requirements that are necessary to ensure that the service concession regarding ferry traffic to and from Gotland meets the needs of passengers and other actors.
Peter Hultqvist (S)
Madam Speaker! Thank you, Minister, for the answer! Of course, in the time we live in, this is a very important issue. That is why we in the Committee on Defence took the initiative for a meeting with the Director General of the Transport Administration. Since that meeting, a great deal has occurred that I would like to tell the Minister about in this matter.
Due to the questions that have come from the Committee on Defence, Trafikverket has prepared a specific memorandum where they have analyzed the regulations for how to handle different bidders and raised the issue of change of control clauses and so on. It is a good follow-up to the meeting we had, and it has led to the procurement being postponed for a while. It will now take place in June.
The procurement concerns matters that have been raised, for example what happens in the event of changes in ownership, whether they can be approved, and whether there is an opportunity to terminate and thus not approve changes in ownership. Where are the boundaries? How should the company's management and subcontractors be viewed? Clauses regarding those types of issues must be woven into the contract. Requirements are also placed on language – in this case Swedish – and a security-protected procurement is conducted with a security protection agreement, a security protection analysis, and total defense information.
The procurement will be issued in June, and a candidate must be ready by the beginning of 2024. By February 1, 2027, the new operator must be up and running with a contract for eight years plus an option for two years. I thought it was a quite interesting development because the Director General visited the Committee on Defence. They have also moved forward in the matter and have worked out so-called security regulations for Gotlandstrafiken with a number of points.
The question is how the government views this, since different types of communications are conducted in a number of areas within the state administration. These are things that can have implications for security aspects. In that case, one must as the responsible minister have a deep knowledge of this. One must also conduct a follow-up to ensure that all considerations are taken into account in connection with procurements.
This is probably not a self-evident matter that takes effect immediately, because for very many years it has not functioned that way. It is about weaving a security culture into the public administration. I believe for my part that it is important that aspects such as these are woven into the government's regulatory letters to various agencies.
I am pleased that the Transport Administration so clearly adopted what we in the Committee on Defence discussed in that context. That means that the answer I have received here is, to some extent, overstated. I submitted my interpellation quite a long time ago, and it has taken quite a long time to reach the chamber to discuss the matter.
What conclusions does the Minister draw from the sequence of events that I have presented here?
Statsrådet Andreas Carlson (KD)
Madam Speaker! I would have gladly come here earlier to discuss the issue, but I understood that the members also had obstacles at some earlier time. Now, however, we are here.
I conclude that this is positive. I believe that we have common interests in this. Sweden has an interest, and that is that it should take place in the best way possible. I have, of course, informed myself about both the meeting in the Committee on Defence and the follow-up afterwards.
In the material that Trafikverket has submitted to the Committee on Defence, I see that they have provided information on how Trafikverket will handle the work going forward. It is Trafikverket that is responsible for the procurement. I am following this closely.
The following appears from the written documentation: The Armed Forces use the procured ferry traffic to and from Gotland for its needs regarding transport of both personnel, equipment, and vehicles. When the current contracts were procured, no needs were considered to exist to specifically point out the Armed Forces' requirements for security protection. Since the security situation has tightened in our immediate area since then, Trafikverket will carry out a security-protected procurement. Consultations will take place with the Armed Forces to take into account their needs of this within the framework of the procured traffic.
Several parts of what Peter Hultqvist mentioned in his opening speech are present in this. It concerns ownership, management, subcontractors, and language.
I want to emphasize one thing that Peter Hultqvist said: the security culture in the public administration. It obviously needs to be strengthened. During the last parliamentary term, I was vice chairman of the Committee on Justice, and we worked extensively with the Security Protection Act. We are all, of course, keen that its implementation happens as quickly as possible. It is something I follow very closely and closely with the agencies that fall under my area of responsibility. Trafikverket is one such in that specific case.
I believe that the answer given in this situation – that a security-protected procurement will be carried out and will be done in consultation with the Armed Forces – meets the concern that I believe lay behind the question that the interpellor asked and that he has therefore received an answer to it, Madam Speaker.
Peter Hultqvist (S)
Madam Speaker! In the drafted safety regulations for Gotlandstrafiken, the following is stated: Safety culture is about an organization's collective way of thinking and acting in relation to risk and safety, that is, how an organization prioritizes and actually works with risks and safety linked to its operations. The transport operator shall continuously work with issues regarding safety culture, and a good reporting culture is encouraged. The transport operator shall at least once a year measure safety culture within the assignment.
Very important points are being made here. I must say that I am satisfied with our initiative and what Trafikverket has reported so far regarding which measures have been taken. But my question to the minister was: Do you intend to proceed with setting such requirements in regulatory letters? That would be a way for the government to signal the importance of this.
When the committee met with Trafikverket, I noticed that they had not intended to think in these terms before the meeting, but this became the result of the discussion, which I think is very good.
I believe that the question of security culture is a problem in a broader sense. Even if one has worked with it and spoken about it at conferences, and even if prominent figures think they have said this time and again, it is not the same as it having taken hold sufficiently well within the agency. This applies to the entire state administration.
Another truly interesting question in this context is that Trafikverket has previously conducted an investigation on Gotland transport and how it should be operated in the future. They have advocated for a model that involves establishing a state tonnage with state-owned companies. Then, the operation is procured and outsourced to an operator. They argue that the whole thing would then be operated towards a higher level of safety.
There are naturally risks with that against the background that the state has no experience of shipping operations with passenger ships, but it is seen as manageable. I want to emphasize that it is an operator that is to handle the whole thing.
In this way, one also has an opportunity to make investments in such a way that the state can obtain more favorable interest rates than the market has. One also has the opportunity to write off the tonnage over a longer period. Therefore, the capital cost in this context becomes lower than the market's.
This is the model that is considered cheapest in the long run when it comes to comparison costs. However, it is not relevant for this procurement, as the time to make such an arrangement is too short. It is instead more about what happens after this eight-year period. There is also a possibility for an extension of two years, but we know nothing about that.
Is this a thought that the minister can imagine developing and standing behind eventually? It would, in that case, be an interesting announcement in today's debate. I think the investigation that Trafikverket has conducted is both thorough and well-considered. The different alternatives for running this are well-balanced.
Statsrådet Andreas Carlson (KD)
Madam Speaker! Regarding the first question, the Swedish Transport Administration must, of course, take into account the current security policy situation in our immediate vicinity. I assume and am convinced that the Swedish Transport Administration does so. The Security Protection Act, which I mentioned in my previous statement, applies, and the government agencies naturally follow it.
Is it ruled out to strengthen this further in regulatory letters and other assignments and instructions? No, that is not something I dismiss, Madam Speaker. This answers Peter Hultqvist's first question.
According to today's procurement model, Trafikverket procures an operator that has its own tonnage. When it comes to the extent to which the state should change this situation, I have no new information to provide today. I do not wish to take a position on it. Furthermore, it is a question that lies far in the future, and it can, of course, be discussed. But I note that the previous government also abstained from taking a position on whether the state should own or control its own tonnage in the Gotland traffic.
Now we are where we are. We have a procurement that is underway. We have accounted for what Trafikverket takes into consideration in its work. That is the most important thing to follow here and now. Then we can return to other discussions further ahead. I have no new information to give in this debate, Madam Speaker.
Peter Hultqvist (S)
Madam Speaker! It is good that the Minister says that he does not rule out this regarding setting requirements in the regulatory letter. But it is not the same as the Minister saying that he intends to set this requirement in the regulatory letter. It would be good if I could get a clarification. Does it go as far as that the Minister is prepared to ultimately take that initiative, so that it is not just a general statement here today in the debate? It was a good 50-percent answer, one could say.
I also want to raise the issue of own tonnage. I think the investigation that has been carried out is thorough, interesting, and good. As I said in my previous post, I completely agree that this cannot be implemented now. It is not relevant at the current moment, but it might be a long-term solution. One might need to deepen the knowledge regarding the effect of own tonnage. Then, one can bring in an operator who handles the actual operation and traffic. I think it is worth testing the issue without, for that reason, saying exactly how we should do it. There are many different investigations that must be carried out, but I think it is good that Trafikverket takes it up.
The Minister says that he assumes that Trafikverket takes different considerations into account. I believe that as a minister, one cannot always assume that things happen in a certain way, but must ensure that they do. That was, in any case, an experience I had during my eight years at the Ministry of Defence – many times one must ensure that it is in a certain way.
When it comes to the security aspects, I can say that we are far from finished with instilling the right security mindset in the state administration.
Statsrådet Andreas Carlson (KD)
Madam Speaker! I share the view that we are far from finished.
If one assumes or guarantees is perhaps almost a semantic question. I follow this very closely. I have stated that Trafikverket, in its response to the Defence Committee, has given the notification that a security-protected procurement shall be carried out. Then consultations with the Armed Forces will also take place so that their needs shall be taken into account within the framework of the procured traffic. I will follow this. I assume that both of these important authorities do their jobs to take care of the interests that are important to defend and consider in this context.
Madam Speaker! I must thank you for the judgment that it was at least a 50-percent answer to the first question. One does not always reach those levels; Peter Hultqvist has great experience with interpellation answers from all sides and angles. Of course, we follow this closely. When it comes to own tonnage, it may be an even worse answer in percentage terms. I dismiss nothing. In-depth knowledge, as Hultqvist mentions, I am always in favor of. Trafikverket has now taken this up. Of course, we will follow the question further in good dialogue.
Here and now, it is important for the government and for me to presuppose and assure ourselves that this procurement proceeds. It is Trafikverket's responsibility. I am confident that they, following the follow-up, the Defense Committee meeting, and the report that has been submitted with accounts and answers to questions from the Riksdag, will carry out the procurement in a correct and good manner.
Let us return to the question of instilling a security mindset in all parts of the public administration and in the entire Swedish society! I believe that we both are in general agreement on this. There is much more to be done here. Thank you for the debate!
Source: The Swedish Parliament. The speeches come from the open data of the Riksdag, translated into English by AI, which may contain errors.