Response to interpellation 2023/24:789 on higher education throughout the country
Translated from Swedish by AI; the translation may contain errors. The Swedish text is the original.
Summary AI, written in advance
1 L considers that independent distance courses during S's time have created quality problems 1. 2 3 L wants to prioritize education within shortage occupations and the green transition over hobby-like courses 2 3. 1 L wants to safeguard campus-based education and redistribute the ceiling amount to strengthen STEM subjects 1. 4 S considers that higher education must be accessible throughout the country and that distance education is crucial for the skills requirement 4. 5 S is concerned that L's proposals risk local campuses 5. 6 S wants to stand up for a broad educational tradition where education can take place in many ways 6. 7 L considers that S expanded places to hide youth unemployment instead of quality 7.
Written by AI in advance and may contain errors. The numbers lead to the speech a statement builds on; check against the text below.
Utbildningsministern Mats Persson (L)
Mr. Speaker! Mats Wiking has asked me what I intend to do so that the competence needs will be met throughout the country when I want to reduce distance education. Mats Wiking has also asked me what I mean by my statements that higher education institutions that conduct incorrect distance education should receive lower state grants and what incorrect distance education is.
In an article in Svenska Dagbladet, I have argued for reducing the flow of independent courses and distance courses that have been built up during the Socialdemokraternas time in power. In recent years, the number of students at Swedish universities has increased sharply. The expansion has been characterized by more people studying independent courses. This development is driven by an increased supply of independent distance courses.
A fundamental problem is that distance education is often not completed. Only 54 percent of students in independent distance courses complete their courses. This is a quality problem. When students do not complete their courses, they learn less, and the university does not receive the compensation it would have received if the courses had been completed.
Another challenge in this context is that not enough courses meet, for example, the competence needs of industry, the total defense, or healthcare. I believe that both the students' and the educational institutions' time and resources could be used better.
In order for us to manage the green transition, the education system must function at all levels. It is as much about solar cell installers as it is about nuclear engineers.
In accordance with the proposals in the budget bill for 2024 (prop. 2023/24:1), funds have been allocated for more places within the university colleges. The purpose of the initiative is to meet the continued large competence needs throughout Sweden, enable the transition, and promote the matching on the labor market.
The initiative means that more people will have the opportunity to study within the university colleges. The Swedish Council for Higher Vocational Education granted more than 40,000 new places in January 2024 across over 470 vocational education programs, of which a quarter are within the area of technology and manufacturing. Several of the vocational education programs are also offered at a distance.
Distance education and decentralized educational environments are important to, for example, enable further education and for students to be able to combine work and family life with studies. At the same time, high-quality distance education places great demands on both pedagogy and technical solutions. That almost half of those who take a standalone course at a distance do not complete the course is therefore a warning signal that must be taken seriously.
The Government has commented on how the educational offerings within universities and colleges should be developed moving forward. In the budget bill for 2024, the Government states that it is important to safeguard campus-based education in order to maintain a qualitative educational and research environment and a qualitative educational offering.
Furthermore, the government states that a redistribution of the institutions' ceiling amounts will take place starting from 2025. The purpose of the redistribution is to strengthen the drivers for a high-quality educational offering in order to provide the labor market with the competence needed in, among other things, science, technology, engineering and mathematics, so-called STEM subjects. Therefore, a planned upcoming reduction is to be based on programs with low activity and throughput as well as on the extent of independent courses in areas where it is not judged that a corresponding shortage exists on the labor market.
There is also a need to develop the range of courses. The new transition study support means that more working people will study within higher education. In order to be entitled to transition study support, the education must strengthen the individual's position on the labor market based on the labor market's needs.
That is why it is important that the educational institutions both have incentives to develop their educational offerings and have the opportunity to offer education over time. Recently, the government therefore commissioned an investigator to assist the Ministry of Education in investigating a specific compensation model for education for transition and further education for professionals.
Mats Wiking (S)
Mr. Speaker! Following an interview in Dagens Eko, sharp criticism has arisen against Education Minister Mats Persson. The Minister stated there that too much distance education and independent courses are being conducted and that instead, there should be an investment in technical education.
Mr. Speaker! We Social Democrats are not against an investment in technical education, but we view the government's desire to increase support for STEM education positively. But when the Minister, in the same interview, suggests that this should occur at the expense of distance education and independent courses, we are not aligned with the Minister's line of thinking.
We Social Democrats believe that higher education must be accessible throughout the country. The need for independent courses and distance education is great, partly to meet the competence needs across the entire country but also so that higher education is not only available in cities where colleges and universities are located.
We are not alone in the criticism. At many higher education institutions, there is simmering anger over the minister questioning the institutions' knowledge of what needs exist among Sweden's students and the competence needs of companies. The protests come from a large and heterogeneous group, from higher education institutions, individual researchers, freelance writers, Timbro representatives, Sveriges förenade studentkårer, SFS, and a number of trade unions.
The Chair of the Swedish Association of University Teachers and Researchers, SULF, writes that she is dismayed to have read the proposal for stricter management of higher education's educational offerings. She writes, among other things: "To steer in the short term towards 'useful' subjects that only concern the existing labor market is also a serious obstacle to promoting the business sector, ensuring the supply of skills and strengthening Sweden's competitiveness on the global stage."
Mr. Speaker! Even the rectors of the two largest universities, Lund and Uppsala, have joined together in a joint response. They write that they must assume that Mats Persson means well but has misunderstood what an independent course is. They think that the Minister for Education is trivializing and engaging in gross simplifications and that the problem is not the free courses but that higher education is underfunded.
Furthermore, one can read that Lena Mäler at the Faculty of Science at Stockholm University writes that the largest part of the independent courses that the universities offer are included in various educational programs.
When it comes to the number of independent courses having increased, SFS can demonstrate that the very starting point for Persson's reasoning is incorrect, as the number of students in independent courses has decreased in absolute terms and as a proportion of higher education from 28 percent to 23 percent.
In the country, there are examples from Mittuniversitetet, which argues that the proposal would have serious consequences, resulting in fewer students in Jämtland, Härjedalen, and Västmanland. They would have difficulty studying remotely because precisely the remote education programs are being reduced. There are great distances in northern Sweden, and remote education with independent courses is a way to manage higher studies there.
The list can be long of those who criticize the proposals from the minister. Nowhere does the minister receive support for the proposals. What does the minister say about the criticism from educational institutions, individual researchers, freelance writers and so on? Does the minister not believe that one should listen to the criticism? Is the minister prepared to do so and change his position?
Utbildningsministern Mats Persson (L)
Mr. Speaker! Thanks to Mats Wiking for the interpellation!
In recent years, there has been a very large increase in independent courses at a distance. It is even to the extent that the majority of the independent courses in the system today are provided within the framework of distance education. As I pointed out in my previous contribution, many of those types of educations have dropouts, and then I think that from the society's side we must ask ourselves what type of educations we want and whether it is reasonable to have many educations where the number of dropouts is high.
A flora of courses has emerged in recent years that some people perceive to be of a somewhat hobby-like character; it could be courses in wine knowledge or beer knowledge or that deal with cats' behavior. I believe that we collectively in society need to ask ourselves whether it is reasonable that these are academic educations. Is it reasonable to receive student grants to attend such a course? I believe that is the discussion we must have.
We are in a situation with great competence needs in the welfare sector and the green transition. When we now make large expansions and historical investments in engineering education and more nurses, it must naturally also mean that if more people are to study to become engineers and nurses, fewer people must study something else. Otherwise, the equation does not add up.
I believe that we in society must have a discussion and debate about what is reasonable to have in the education system and whether this type of hobby-like courses are what we want to prioritize in this situation. I welcome such a discussion and debate.
Mats Wiking (S)
Mr. Speaker! I thank the Minister for the answer, but I still want to point out that regarding the pressure from educational institutions, trade unions and the business community, I received no answer.
During the spring, the undersigned and the Moderaternas spokesperson for higher education organized a seminar on the development of campuses and decentralized distance education. Several colleges and universities today have well-developed collaborations with municipalities where the purpose is to provide higher education locally. Several evaluations show that both educational institutions and municipalities want to develop the collaboration. The collaboration means that programs and independent courses can be provided at a distance to meet local needs, and it is absolutely crucial for local campuses to be able to provide higher education.
The local campuses also have a very good cooperation with the local business community and the public sector. Education is tailored based on the local labor market needs.
In the report New Paths, which was made regarding the development of local campuses, it clearly appears that it is a successful recipe. A decentralized education is not only located at different campuses, but one also ensures that specially trained staff are present on campus to support the students in their education, specifically to develop and improve the results regarding distance education. The education becomes a mix of distance education and location-based education by having certain elements take place on-site while the majority is at a distance. The staff who are location-based contribute to increased throughput and fewer dropouts, and that is precisely what the minister requests.
One can see from the evaluations that the municipalities concerned have succeeded in pushing down unemployment and that more people, through the skills enhancement, have been able to take the jobs that were vacant.
Mr. Speaker! The interpellation presents three examples of cities where, through distance education, competence has been raised and continues to be raised, enabling people to remain in the locality during the education thanks to the development of cooperation between higher education institutions and local campuses.
Mr. Speaker! We Social Democrats are concerned that if the Minister for Education carries out what he says he wants to do, the basic idea of local campuses to offer high-quality distance education is at risk, because the Minister wants to lower the compensation to higher education institutions that, according to the Minister, conduct the wrong type of distance education.
I want to ask what the Minister for Education thinks about the local campuses emerging in the country, which are and have been a good alternative for conducting distance education and independent courses. How are local campuses to survive if the grants for distance education and independent courses are reduced?
Utbildningsministern Mats Persson (L)
Mr. Speaker! It is important to emphasize that in the Swedish system, there will always be the opportunity to study independent courses. That is something no one questions. It is a strength that one can study history, literary studies, or equivalent courses at universities and colleges. It is naturally a strength and something that will also be possible in the future. It is particularly important so that one can educate oneself, develop, and grow as a human being.
It is also important that we have a system where one can study at universities and colleges within the framework of lifelong learning. There is now a model where more and more people choose to pursue further education in the middle of life. There is great interest in studying to become a police officer, teacher, nurse, and also in educating oneself in technical subjects. This happens within the framework of what is called transition study support, which many people are currently taking part in. It is a very exciting reform that I believe is here to stay.
Regarding lifelong learning, the higher education institutions today do not receive compensation in a way that is fully adapted to the fact that adults study while they work. That is also why the government has taken the initiative for an investigation to see if one can have a different type of compensation system so that the higher education institutions get better incentives and opportunities to offer that type of course within the framework of lifelong learning.
Mr. Speaker! At the same time, politics is about prioritizing, and this government prioritizes education. We are now expanding education within many shortage occupations that exist in society, which the industry and companies in the green transition are crying out for and which people in the core of the welfare system, not least healthcare, are crying out for. Therefore, the government is expanding those types of educations.
We also think it is important to have a discussion on whether it is reasonable to continue the massive expansion of independent courses, especially at a distance, which the Social Democrats initiated when they were in power. We welcome such a discussion, and such a discussion must be had.
Mats Wiking (S)
Mr. Speaker! We who were born in the countryside and lived far away had to move to larger cities to be able to study at university and receive an education. For many of us, it was tough to take the step to higher studies because the society and the family we came from lacked a tradition of education. Having to move far from family and friends can also cause those who actually have the aptitude to drop out of their education.
Mr. Speaker! At the same time, there are those who long for university life - to move out from home, study, make new friends, and feel the freedom of standing on their own two feet.
We humans are different. We are at different places in life when it is time for higher studies or further education. One student can be 19 years old and have just finished upper secondary school. Another can be 44 years old with a desire to study further but have children aged six and eleven and a large commitment to an association in the locality. Both want to study, but the circumstances are different.
While the 19-year-old moves to the big city with university, the 44-year-old chooses the local campus to study one course at a time. Hen is unsure if hen can manage the studies and does not want to miss the children's upbringing. By living in the small town where there has been an investment in higher education at the local campus, hen manages both the studies and the social life.
In many ways, it can be seen that flexibility is a keyword for how education should be available throughout life. We Social Democrats want to stand up for the Swedish education and cultivation tradition, where cultivation and education for the individual citizen can take place in many different ways - through, for example, an independent course at a university, but also through a study circle in Medborgarskolan. Not being able to offer cultivation and education of a broader scope makes Sweden poorer.
When it comes to education, the minister's party colleague has in recent days presented an investigation on popular education. The investigator points out that education is important, that access to education must exist at different levels, and that interest and joy must also be allowed to be a part of the educational and educational offerings.
Utbildningsministern Mats Persson (L)
Mr. Speaker! I thank Mats Wiking for the interpellation debate and welcome his commitment to the issue. I think at the same time that we should be honest and say that there is an ideological dividing line in the view of what the role of universities and colleges should be. It is obvious that the Social Democrats during their years in power saw this as part of the labor market policy and regional policy. They wanted to hide youth unemployment. For many years, they deliberately and actively expanded the number of places. The goal has been to ensure that as many as possible study at college instead of ensuring that the college maintains sufficiently high quality.
The price for this is paid by our students today. There are too few laboratories for those studying a technical education. There are too few teacher-led hours and too few lessons at our universities and colleges in very many subjects, not least among the technical subjects. It is the price that is being paid right now for the Social Democrats' many-year policy.
That is also why the government is now shifting the policy and ensuring that we get more laboratory sessions and more math hours in our technical education. Many of our principals and many students have warned against the development that occurred during the Social Democrats' time. We are correcting this now. The problems we have inherited from the previous Social Democratic government, we are handling right now.
I think it is unfortunate that the Social Democrats are trying to muddy the waters and are not admitting what has been the party's strategy. But it is welcome that we have a debate in Sweden about whether it is reasonable that we have these types of hobby-like courses within the framework of higher education activities or if we should do it in a different way.
Source: The Swedish Parliament. The speeches come from the open data of the Riksdag, translated into English by AI, which may contain errors.